i have been lurking on this site for the past 2 months.
for the past few years i have been going to the meetings and doing fieldservice out of guilt.. my husband (twisty) told me regularly i only do it out of guilt but i denied it and said it i want to do these things because i love jehovah and it is the right thing to do, but how can it be the right thing if you don't feel welcome and it feels like everyone is judging you the moment you walk into the kingdom hall.. it has taken a few years and a lot of tears to open my eyes.. over the past few years twisty spoke to me about the various things he didn't agree with but it just went over my head.
a few months ago we were lying in bed and he brought up his concerns again, and i'm not sure what was different this time but i understood and agreed with the points he was making.
Thanx for sharing.
You might want to consider a successful 'fade' in order to maintain relationships with your family. Me? I can't keep my mouth shut well enough for that - but some have done it well.
Otherwise - welcome. Happy New Year to you - it's a great way to start it, eh?
Jeff
ok i lied; there's no such news item.
however, imagine for a minute that it was indeed fact and that the evidence was irrefutable that the new testiment account in the bible was proven to be a hoax started by the early constantine government and perpetuated by the church over the centuries.
now, if you are of the atheist persuation it seems plausable that your reaction would be something similar to "i told you so" and that life would go on pretty much as usual.
People don't follow religion because of evidence, proof or logic - they do it because of traditions, upbringing, superstitions and for it's "opiate" effect.
Well stated, Simon.
Though the inverse might be true on occasion - that some will leave off belief in these things when, at the right moment in their life journey, evidence and logic overcome the tradition, upbringing, superstitions to which they are held captive. Though admittedly, for most, this will not happen quickly, but over time and with a preponderance of weight that becomes impossible to ignore. Sadly, most never will.
Edited to state that my statements may not in fact be precisely the inverse of Simon's suggestion [someone is sure to correct that and derail the primary point of this thread] - but you get the point.
Jeff
one thing i regret, is not listening to the questions in my head whilst a jw.
one i didn't ask until years after leaving was....who designed disease?
of course the first thing to realise is the complexity of disease, the histology, pathology and aetiology.
This is an interesting explore.
I find it massively interesting to watch the fundies scramble to discredit solid science in favor of dreamy 'faith'.
Let's just face it - Once rib-woman dared to seek knowledge without permission from her loving god/daddy who would be later credited with murder of several million of her descendents - she created all this evil. How could science really overcome that SOLID argument?
Jeff
www.1260days.com www.answerjw.com www.bibleanswermachine.ww7.com .
www.bibleforetoldholocaust.com www.bluehelmetstojerusalem.com .
www.cftf.com www.christiansrepent.com www.jerusalemverses.com .
Reed is hard to take for me. He is too intelligent to have never gotten it. Too bad.
Jeff
after seeing most of the season unfold, i am going to make my prediction who will be in the super bowl this year.
after seeing the play of most teams i am ready to go out on a limb.. here is the official prediction:.
the super bowl will have the green bay packers vs. the baltimore ravens.
New England and Denver face off this week. I predict the winner of that game will also be in the SuperBowl for the AFC. Tebow and Brady both know how to pull it out in the 4th quarter, and make no mistake, this will be perhaps one of the best 4th quarter games of the season.
I think NE will win this one, and go on to clinch the AFC title in a few weeks. GB will, barring any unforseen injury, go undefeated, and will win the NFC title.
SB prediction: GB wins by 4 in a battle of the air.
Jeff
this is not the actual photo of the sign and the article writer is the one making most of the racist remarks in an attempt to reveal the stupidity here:.
from: http://jezebel.com/5868076/woman-still-doesnt-understand-why-her-white-only-swimming-pool-is-racist.
woman still doesnt understand why her white only swimming pool is racistan ohio landlord who posted a "white only" sign outside her property's swimming pool is requesting that the state reconsider its ruling.
"You can't fix Stupid!"
i am a fan of anything wts hates, like smurfs and birthdays, clinking glasses in a toast, exchanging gifts on december 25th.
i have never really been the person to set new year's resolutions, but it is something wts would not like.. anyway, i used to read blondie's comments on the wt study article.
i remember how it kept me mad at wts to read such stupid stuff from them.
I know what you mean. I used to spend a high percentage of my free time right here - and I always found myself stewing over the WTS's hold on the Jw's. I can't remember the last time I clicked on a topic that discussed much about the WTS and it's articles. In fact, I find myself here about 3 or 4% of the amount of time I used to spend here - and I usually just click through the first two or three pages of active topics - more often than not just closing the website and moving onto something else on the internet or the book I am reading.
I do feel better. Once the primary healing is done - it prob better to get out of the hospital and only check in from time to time to assess progress. JWN had been a great tool - but there comes a time for most of us that it is needed less and less. Good for you.
Jeff
a person of faith is loyal.. a person of faith will not give up.. a person of faith considers it an act of love to refuse to let go.. and yet, the definition of insanity is refusing to change when confronted with disproof!.
jehovah's witnesses are taught loyalty to the organization.. jehovah's witnesses are confronted with propects of persecution by odd doctrinal views that set them at odds with others.. being obstinate about quirky views is a badge of their faith.. from 1968 through 1975 the test of faith was telling the world about a momentous fiction described as the end of 6,000 years of human existence.. it was, of course, utterly silly and a non-event which totally back-fired.
because it was superficially linked to armageddon.
Good point. I think it could apply far more broadly than just to Jehovah's Witnesses.
Jeff
funny the way our minds unwind and refocus after leaving a high control religion.. when i first left the jdubs i saw them more closely to what the entire world sees them i suppose, but not truly clearly at those early stages.
they still looked to me to be 'good people' but misguided.
as time went on, though the misguided feature remained, the 'good people' supposition faded.
Well stated Glad.
I 'yanked the door off' a couple years back. I admitted my doubts, examined the reasons for them [precisely zero evidence for any god or gods], and decided to pull off the mask of uncertainty. I think Pascal was wrong in his Wager. If we see a nation conduct a lottery, but there is never a winner, then why would we continue to wager for the chance we might be the first winner someday? It seems more likely there are no real winners, and there never will be, and that the scam is just taking hearts without mercy.
On the other hand, if god is real, all he has to do is show himself. He won't. And the best evidence for his lack of appearance is that he isn't. Until further evidence arrives [and mankind has been waiting for it for millenia after millenia], why waste a single electron of energy in 'faith' [just another word for 'there is no reason to believe it, but I do anyway cause I hope to enter a better place when this one disapears].
Peace/Namaste to all this fine day.
Jeff
funny the way our minds unwind and refocus after leaving a high control religion.. when i first left the jdubs i saw them more closely to what the entire world sees them i suppose, but not truly clearly at those early stages.
they still looked to me to be 'good people' but misguided.
as time went on, though the misguided feature remained, the 'good people' supposition faded.
It's good to know someone who has knowledge of all things seen and unseen.
Of all knowledge past, present and future.
Just stating my viewpoint, Warlock. Is that still allowed here? What I state is true - to me, if not to you.
Everything that IS started 13.7 Billion years ago, from a moment of hot dense energy. Every molecule, every star, every drop of water, originated due to the Big Bang, not due to god. There is MASSIVE evidence to support this theory. So, to someone who accepts reality, based on solid science - sin, heaven, hell, god, devil are all just mankind's constructs to explain what science is now explaining in our modern era. Facts are better than superstition - that's all I am saying. Some posters are always looking to defend what they believe - without the very first shred of evidence - [if you dispute what I say, then show me some evidence, sir] and still they find those of us who state that obvious fact as 'arrogant'.
I have thrown off the robe of 'belief/faith' because there is precisely zero reason to continue believing things without evidence. That has nothing to do with Sab's contentions either. If he finds himself upset by my words, then it might be time for him to buck up and take an honest look at the ideas passed to him from shepherds of 3000 years ago. Personally, I find it far more comforting to accept reality, knowing we are mortal, there is nothing beyond this life, than to hold onto dreamlike visions of god without evidence. If that makes someone uncomfortable - well, ok.
Jeff
